A Taste Of Things To Come

[davef]

Hi, we put this feature on the website last night   www.suttonunited.net/football-2020-style/ , as we thought everyone would like to get some idea of what football with spectators might mean.

I'd like to stress the caveat that permeates all of our work regarding Covid at the moment, what you see today represents today's thinking, it could all change tomorrow either because we have better ideas or because the Govt/FA/League change the rules.

And, just to make clear, the ultimate rules we are working to come from Government, not the FA.

What we have to consider are:-

• Mandatory League protocols around the first team 
• Mandatory League protocols around operating the stadium
• Protocols for all other users of the stadium
• Revised stadium capacity calculations
• Physical measures in the stadium
• Revised operating procedures for the stadium

All of these have to be approved by our new Medical Officer and also by either the NL or the LBS Licensing Officer, or both !

[sallycat]

We are not going to be able to provide normal segregation measures to accommodate away fans in the current circumstances. Not what we would want if everything was “normal” of course but impractical given the layout of our stadium.

Dave, does this mean "no segregation" or "no away fans at all"?

[davef]

No firm decision yet but leaning towards the latter. The League will allow each club to make up its own mind.

And yes, we did nick your suggestion about entry tickets !!

[trev]

Thanks for the update, davef. We're very fortunate to have such capable hands on deck, and such a high quality of engagement with supporters. I can see from the link how much work has been carried out behind the scenes in getting the stadium "match fit", although I suspect this is just the tip of the iceberg!

Just a couple of queries -

I'm not that familiar with Quick Response (QR) Codes - what does this mean for fans in practice?

There's no mention of face coverings - I appreciate they're not mandatory in outdoor settings, but will fans be encouraged to wear them in consideration for other fans who may feel vulnerable? I know some clubs who opened their doors last weekend e.g. Carshalton have such policies..

[davef]

There's a lot of things not mentioned there ! One of the key documents the league and LBS are encouraging clubs to have in place is a Spectators' Charter. It is accepted that only so much can be achieved through physical measures, we will need people to cooperate. Engagement in advance over what we do/want to do is very important, so feedback around face coverings would be valued.

Our thinking is we want to encourage everyone to wear a face covering as much as possible during their visit, but we would not make it mandatory. (Staff/Volunteers will be wearing them though). We'd love to hear what you think.

[Stewart]

Aug 25, 2020 10:15:05 GMT davef said:

There's a lot of things not mentioned there ! One of the key documents the league and LBS are encouraging clubs to have in place is a Spectators' Charter. It is accepted that only so much can be achieved through physical measures, we will need people to cooperate. Engagement in advance over what we do/want to do is very important, so feedback around face coverings would be valued.

Our thinking is we want to encourage everyone to wear a face covering as much as possible during their visit, but we would not make it mandatory. (Staff/Volunteers will be wearing them though). We'd love to hear what you think.

I would wear a mask if requested. However I would rather stand away from others and not wear one.

[dof]

Re face masks I for one if I am on the terraces would not wear one, would observe the 2 metre rule, I find them unpleasant and not convinced of their value. Must confess I did wear a gas mask during the Blitz.

There is no mention of kneeling before the game I have two dodgy knees and would never get down or up (joke)

Thanks for all you and your committee do Dave, must be a nightmare.

[kpinwp]

Re. face masks. I really wouldn't put yourself (or us) into the position where the wearing of them is not mandatory but is encouraged. I know it seems like a very reasonable attempt at accommodating all opinion but it's a recipe for season long, ongoing, divisive arguments between those who consider masks necessary and those who don't.

Either call them as mandatory as they are considered necessary, or call them as not required. Then, those who wish to wear can but can't complain of those who don't. We need regulation, here, not advice.

(Late edit). I know that may sound draconian but in the case of face masks one person's 'reasonable' is another person's 'irresponsible'. It's bad enough, in other situations, where those who wear them fully (correctly, in fact) argue with those who pull them down off of their noses, or take them off when their mobile rings. Or argue about if they'e far anough away from them if unmasked. Let's not have a season of that, please.

[Del]

My glasses steam up with a face mask on so wouldn't see much of the game !

[garethl]

I would prefer not to wear a mask/face covering. Given the likely numbers restriction and the fact we’re outdoors it doesn’t seem necessary to me. I would wear something if mandatory and it wouldn’t put me off coming. I have been to the cinema and worn a running buff and it was no bother.

Additional view is the club give themselves an issue they could avoid by deeming them necessary in that it would then need policing. It’s just another issue to worry about then on top of everything else. As long as it doesn’t impact a) being given the go ahead for attendances and b) mean limiting numbers more than would otherwise be the case then I would stay silent on the issue. Anyone wanting to wear one is of course welcome to do so!

I guess the other remaining question is whether the issue would mean some don’t come that otherwise would. Can’t see that being more than the number you can count on one hand (if any) but I have no basis for that!

[kpinwp]

I'm very happy to wear a face mask in any location in which it's deemed necessary.

However, and at the risk of banging on, if you decide masks are not manditory but are to be ecouraged you are, de facto, saying that it is better for people to wear one. Which is to say, 'we are not making you wear one but we are hoping you will wear one out of consideration for others'. Which is to say ' it's up to you to be one of the good guys'.

That's when the arguments begin. ("I don't have to." "No, but you should anyway...")

[mitcham_badlander]

I normally loathe mixing football with politics (except my unwavering support for the PROWS) but I think we can fairly say that this year politics has been foisted on us; and in my view it is politics, not a pandemic as I would recognise it, and the government's scientists now run the country to the detriment of everything else.  To make my point, I might quote some extracts from what Prof Mark Woolhouse OBE, a member of the Scientific Pandemic Influenza Group on Behaviours that advises the government, said in yesterday's Daily Express:

"Lockdown was a panic measure and I believe history will say trying to control Covid-19 through lockdown was a monumental mistake on a global scale, the cure was worse than the disease."

"We absolutely should never return to a position where children cannot play or go to school. I believe the harm lockdown is doing to our education, health care access, and broader aspects of our economy and society will turn out to be at least as great as the harm done by Covid-19."

"I suspect right now more people are being harmed by the collateral effects of lockdown than by Covid-19. This is why we need a broader range of people on the government advisory board Sage with equal input from economists to assess the damage to incomes, jobs and livelihoods, educationalists to assess the damage to children and mental health specialists to assess levels of depression and anxiety especially among young adults, as well as psychologists to assess the effects of not being able to go to the theatre or a football match."

"At the time I agreed with lockdown as a short term emergency response because we couldn't think of anything better to do*, but it was always clear that the moment we started to relax enough measures we were likely to see infection rates rise again either nationally or locally."

I wish our heroic directors and staff the best of luck navigating the quagmire of pointless regulations and beg that you please don't take away any more of our freedom than you're obliged to by law. 


*How about not panicking like teenagers and letting the thing ride itself out like every cold season? It was obvious from pictures of Wuhan on the telly this wasn't Black Death 2. If you believed Neil Ferguson's obviously flawed projections at the time, do you really deserve that professorship? Apparently it was only me, Peter Hitchens and about 15% of the population who saw through the whole thing from the get-go. If I ran the country &c

[Nick the Greek/The Speshul One]

If masks aren’t mandatory to open the ground to fans by the guidelines then it shouldn’t be mandatory by the club.

[markf]

Aug 25, 2020 18:35:03 GMT mitcham_badlander said:

I normally loathe mixing football with politics (except my unwavering support for the PROWS) but I think we can fairly say that this year politics has been foisted on us; and in my view it is politics, not a pandemic as I would recognise it, and the government's scientists now run the country to the detriment of everything else.  To make my point, I might quote some extracts from what Prof Mark Woolhouse OBE, a member of the Scientific Pandemic Influenza Group on Behaviours that advises the government, said in yesterday's Daily Express:

"Lockdown was a panic measure and I believe history will say trying to control Covid-19 through lockdown was a monumental mistake on a global scale, the cure was worse than the disease."

"We absolutely should never return to a position where children cannot play or go to school. I believe the harm lockdown is doing to our education, health care access, and broader aspects of our economy and society will turn out to be at least as great as the harm done by Covid-19."

"I suspect right now more people are being harmed by the collateral effects of lockdown than by Covid-19. This is why we need a broader range of people on the government advisory board Sage with equal input from economists to assess the damage to incomes, jobs and livelihoods, educationalists to assess the damage to children and mental health specialists to assess levels of depression and anxiety especially among young adults, as well as psychologists to assess the effects of not being able to go to the theatre or a football match."

"At the time I agreed with lockdown as a short term emergency response because we couldn't think of anything better to do*, but it was always clear that the moment we started to relax enough measures we were likely to see infection rates rise again either nationally or locally."

I wish our heroic directors and staff the best of luck navigating the quagmire of pointless regulations and beg that you please don't take away any more of our freedom than you're obliged to by law. 

*How about not panicking like teenagers and letting the thing ride itself out like every cold season? It was obvious from pictures of Wuhan on the telly this wasn't Black Death 2. If you believed Neil Ferguson's obviously flawed projections at the time, do you really deserve that professorship? Apparently it was only me, Peter Hitchens and about 15% of the population who saw through the whole thing from the get-go. If I ran the country &c

Ferguson may have been wrong but try telling that to the 40 odd thousand who have died not to mention their friends and families. As for siding with that maniac Hitchens who bores every Sunday writing either about Covid or drugs (he seems to have lost the imagination to write about anything else other than pen an article about the various beards he has grown over the years - fascinating stuff), please don't expect too much support from this part of the world re your request to the club not foisting more regulation on fans, when all they are doing is following the regs given to them by the powers that be.

[os]

When you mix football with politics you get a load of boll**ks and in truth that is exactly what we have got. Looking at DFs list of objectives it looks like code from Nostradamus. Protocols, Protocols and procedures, the reality is you cannot socially distance 1800 people in a ground like ours, they can't even manage it in Primark, half a dozen stewards have no chance.

Wear a mask. don't wear a mask, go to work, don't go to work, go on holiday, quarantine - I wouldn't want the COVID officers job if you paid me, and poor old DF has to do it for nothing.

I reckon just bundle back into GGL and forget the rest