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Post by baboonfish on Oct 4, 2023 10:19:56 GMT
I'm afraid that suggests, if true - and I've no reason to doubt you, that Matt is starting to lose the dressing room. Its the first time I have felt this to be the case. At the end of the day if the players are doing their best there is only so much composure they can have. I think next home game is now a last gasp for me. But to be fair even if we manage to pull off a win, I am not convinced it will be a case of then climbing the table... More anecdotal evidence - I was seated close to several injured (or possibly dropped, who knows) players in the grandstand for the second half last night. Not naming names but most of them did not look like they gave two craps. Not a murmur out of them and most of them spent the majority of the half on their phones etc. That was not a promising sign for a bonded squad at all. I know being out injured is miserable and players just want to play, but this group included 2 long standing senior squad members who should be more invested in the performance. Matt's post match interview worried me as well. He seemed somewhat deluded in his belief we were competitive in the first half. Yes, we had a great spell 5-10 mins either side of half time, but Salford should have been easily 2-0 up at half time with the chances they had, all created by a simple doubling up on Hart or by our failed press. I know morale can be affected by negative interviews but he should not be making out we gave a good account of ourselves last night. We did not. I'm also convinced our midfield is not L2 standard at all. Look how Salford linked up play through the midfield, whereas we played it around at the back then almost always bypassed our midfield. Clay and N'GUessian have good qualities but should be playing at least a level below, and you could argue the same about Harry. Harry was, I assume, playing out wide to give Hart protection, yet the opposition regularly overloaded that wing and Harry did not seem to do a job there. Their little left winger who scored their second goal was excellent to be fair, but Kizzi lost that battle all day long, with Patrick nowhere to be seen, although I believe that was tactical - 3 centre mids should provide more protection out wide as well but didnt.
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Post by banjo on Oct 4, 2023 11:17:27 GMT
Its the first time I have felt this to be the case. At the end of the day if the players are doing their best there is only so much composure they can have. I think next home game is now a last gasp for me. But to be fair even if we manage to pull off a win, I am not convinced it will be a case of then climbing the table... More anecdotal evidence - I was seated close to several injured (or possibly dropped, who knows) players in the grandstand for the second half last night. Not naming names but most of them did not look like they gave two craps. Not a murmur out of them and most of them spent the majority of the half on their phones etc. That was not a promising sign for a bonded squad at all. I know being out injured is miserable and players just want to play, but this group included 2 long standing senior squad members who should be more invested in the performance. Matt's post match interview worried me as well. He seemed somewhat deluded in his belief we were competitive in the first half. Yes, we had a great spell 5-10 mins either side of half time, but Salford should have been easily 2-0 up at half time with the chances they had, all created by a simple doubling up on Hart or by our failed press. I know morale can be affected by negative interviews but he should not be making out we gave a good account of ourselves last night. We did not. I'm also convinced our midfield is not L2 standard at all. Look how Salford linked up play through the midfield, whereas we played it around at the back then almost always bypassed our midfield. Clay and N'GUessian have good qualities but should be playing at least a level below, and you could argue the same about Harry. Harry was, I assume, playing out wide to give Hart protection, yet the opposition regularly overloaded that wing and Harry did not seem to do a job there. Their little left winger who scored their second goal was excellent to be fair, but Kizzi lost that battle all day long, with Patrick nowhere to be seen, although I believe that was tactical - 3 centre mids should provide more protection out wide as well but didnt. Yes agree with you about Matts interview, saying we did ok first half had chances and then saying he still has things to work on, but when asked he did not say what he had to work on or what the problems are. I’m afraid Matt is a bit deluded if he thinks the players are playing for him too get results and also, don’t we have a right to know what’s going on here as supporters because this is simply not good enough. ⚽️⚽️⚽️
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Post by paz on Oct 4, 2023 11:40:19 GMT
More anecdotal evidence - I was seated close to several injured (or possibly dropped, who knows) players in the grandstand for the second half last night. Not naming names but most of them did not look like they gave two craps. Not a murmur out of them and most of them spent the majority of the half on their phones etc. That was not a promising sign for a bonded squad at all. I know being out injured is miserable and players just want to play, but this group included 2 long standing senior squad members who should be more invested in the performance. Matt's post match interview worried me as well. He seemed somewhat deluded in his belief we were competitive in the first half. Yes, we had a great spell 5-10 mins either side of half time, but Salford should have been easily 2-0 up at half time with the chances they had, all created by a simple doubling up on Hart or by our failed press. I know morale can be affected by negative interviews but he should not be making out we gave a good account of ourselves last night. We did not. I'm also convinced our midfield is not L2 standard at all. Look how Salford linked up play through the midfield, whereas we played it around at the back then almost always bypassed our midfield. Clay and N'GUessian have good qualities but should be playing at least a level below, and you could argue the same about Harry. Harry was, I assume, playing out wide to give Hart protection, yet the opposition regularly overloaded that wing and Harry did not seem to do a job there. Their little left winger who scored their second goal was excellent to be fair, but Kizzi lost that battle all day long, with Patrick nowhere to be seen, although I believe that was tactical - 3 centre mids should provide more protection out wide as well but didnt. Yes agree with you about Matts interview, saying we did ok first half had chances and then saying he still has things to work on, but when asked he did not say what he had to work on or what the problems are. I’m afraid Matt is a bit deluded if he thinks the players are playing for him too get results and also, don’t we have a right to know what’s going on here as supporters because this is simply not good enough. ⚽️⚽️⚽️ To be fair, he could be between a rock and a hard place, managing so many people and keeping them happy is not easy. He looks like a guy who now lacks confidence and has not had a smile on his face for a while now. There are probably a number of things he could attack but he has a squad to look after and to his credit he has never been one to criticize players openly. Unless we see a great result as well as a great performance on Saturday I can't see him maintaining authority over the squad beyond that. The respect will be gone and we will be leaderless. Like the lord of the flies
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Post by Andy K on Oct 4, 2023 12:01:12 GMT
I'm not sure he's being delusional, but it may well be more a case of if he says it enough, it will happen. I don't think Matt knows how to solve the issue, which to be fair puts him with all of us.
Doing so spectacularly badly this season is really hard to pinpoint. The defence is the same as one regularly getting clean sheets. The core of the midfield isn't especially different, and although we've replaced the wingers, they should be on par or better than we've had. As for up front, bearing in mind how many people were moaning about our strike force last season, there has been an obvious emphasis on improving that, which I think compared to last year (took us till March to score more than 2 in a game) we've done.
And yet here we are. We've played and lost enough games to really put away the nonsense about "we've been unlucky" or "the officials have been against us". The only game where we could claim bad luck was Barrow away. Most of the rest have been utterly inept performances - esp Afc Wimbledon, Accrington, Newport, Crawley, FGR and now Salford.
We've got the players, we've tried a number of formations and nothing is working. For those out to blame Matt, perhaps they can explain to us how Matt has gone from a manager talked about in upper divisions to a car crash by doing the same thing.
I do agree however, I think his post match interviews really are starting to come from a place which is less tied to observable reality.
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Post by dundas on Oct 4, 2023 12:31:42 GMT
Hope Beckham isn't - it was his bo at the lane that started the downward spiral. Surely he has his own brand of deodorant. He does, and I hope that lifts the curse or something drastic like wearing yellow socks will be needed
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Post by baboonfish on Oct 4, 2023 12:58:12 GMT
Our problems go well beyond formations, but the only thing left to try is 3 at the back. Kizzi is having a shocking season at RB. When Jackson is 100%, Kizzi could slot into a 3 man defence. Jackson and Hart are nailed on wingbacks, and nothing can make us more vulnerable out wide than we already are. Try Smith and Patrick up front and play whatever 3 CMs we have fit. I know Patrick has signed as a winger, but if the players are calling the shots, there's exhibit A to explain why we're screwed. If Matt or an incoming manager decided to stop playing with wingers, then what's he going to do?
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Post by boomboom on Oct 4, 2023 13:16:43 GMT
I'd suggest the following factors as to why we're doing worse than last season, though they perhaps fail to explain why we're doing so "spectacularly badly".
1. Kizzi and Goodliffe have been a little off the pace.
2. Time is catching up with Milsom who has been playing more minutes than ideal. Plus he's been injured.
3. Midfield hasn't been good enough: - Ali Smith has been a big miss as Matt has as good as acknowledged. - Whilst there were mixed views about Randall, I felt one of his qualities was an ability to retain possession: something we fall well short on. - Eastmond is struggling to have a settled run and it looks like he might be out for a while now with a hamstring injury. - Clay has been ordinary. - N'Guessan shows glimpses of potential but is some way off being an established L2 player. - Beautyman isn't the player he was - For much of the time, Bugiel was playing as an advanced midfielder rather than a target man in the Harry Smith mould. His physical presence is missed.
4. We've brought in players who haven't been fully fit.
5. Last season around this time of year, despite a bad set of injuries, the team had the tenacity to grind out results. That seems to have been lost for whatever reason/s this season.
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Post by ggl on Oct 4, 2023 13:37:25 GMT
As anybody who reads my sporadic posts knows I have been calling for a change of manager for a couple of weeks now , my opinion on that matter has not changed and is very unlikely too unless we win the next five matches at least . Not likely either unfortunately . I’m glad to see that many posters on this forum are now starting to feel the same rather than blame our “performances” as being down to bad luck or awful refereeing decisions as has been the case too many times recently . The main reason I feel a change is now required is because the blame always falls at the managers feet , be that fair or unfair . With the amount of new players brought into the squad during the pre season we can now fully label this as Matt’s squad and it is just not working . I don’t know if this is down to just the players not working hard enough , not being good enough or just not caring enough but it is still Matt’s squad and his tactics on the pitch that are plainly not working anymore . So for me he has to go . Should the board come to the same conclusion before it is too late then I would want a manager who would kick some arses that need kicking and hug and reassure those that require a softer approach . For me most need the first option . It took our wonderful little club a bloody long time to reach the promised land of the EFL ,so let’s not throw it all away just because we have had a culture of not sacking people .
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kpinwp
1st team Player
Posts: 1,245
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Post by kpinwp on Oct 4, 2023 13:45:49 GMT
If it's the case that the players just aren't good enough (for a variety of reasons) for this level, then our goose is cooked whatever we do. But I'm not so sure that is the case and as boomboom mentions, it still wouldn't explain why we're quite so very bad. You'd expect more of a creaking and less of what seems to be a collapse in performance quality.
No team or players perform badly throughout an entire match. But the sheer amount of misjudgement going on last night was extraordinary. There was an element of incoherence throughout the team that, to me, doesn't suggest a combination of particular individual weaknessess ganging up, but a fundamental confusion as to how they were supposed to approach the match.
And let's face it, Salford weren't that good (no offence). We stand to be in for some real tonkings, the way things stand.
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Post by garethl on Oct 4, 2023 13:58:50 GMT
I was quite positive before last night but it looks very grim. Complete lack of clear thinking. We didn’t press at all but they still walked through and round us, we played like an away team in a game that we had to attack. Draws are no good, even to the extent of turning the tide. We have to get back to totally going after sides coming to ours. We aren’t going to win many away even if we get up and running properly. Playing Kasimu upfront on his own was a travesty of a decision, felt sorry for him on his full(?) league debut (though he should have scored if he headed rather than shouldered the ball). How did the whole of the management team manage to come up with and agree that?! Our best bet is to go direct and fast and furious again, get decent balls into the box and compete on everything. Basically back to the drawing board and get the basics of competing and high energy in there. Do that and you’d still think we’ve got some players who can do something. Smith and O’Brien have to start on Saturday if fit and they came through last night ok and we have to target 3 goals.
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Post by baboonfish on Oct 4, 2023 14:13:56 GMT
I was quite positive before last night but it looks very grim. Complete lack of clear thinking. We didn’t press at all but they still walked through and round us, we played like an away team in a game that we had to attack. Draws are no good, even to the extent of turning the tide. We have to get back to totally going after sides coming to ours. We aren’t going to win many away even if we get up and running properly. Playing Kasimu upfront on his own was a travesty of a decision, felt sorry for him on his full(?) league debut (though he should have scored if he headed rather than shouldered the ball). How did the whole of the management team manage to come up with and agree that?! Our best bet is to go direct and fast and furious again, get decent balls into the box and compete on everything. Basically back to the drawing board and get the basics of competing and high energy in there. Do that and you’d still think we’ve got some players who can do something. Smith and O’Brien have to start on Saturday if fit and they came through last night ok and we have to target 3 goals. We absoutely did press but it wasn't effective. The attacking five (Harry, Patrick, Hish, N'GUessian & Clay) were trying to press in numbers, but it only took a tiny bit of quality to escape the press and get straight into our wide areas, as evidenced on several occasions in both halves. This also led to both goals (the corner for the first goal came from a simple overload on the counter which wasn't dealt with). Absolutely agree about the rest and others' comments - Hish up front on his own was an odd call and the midfield shape and press certainly looked like the players did not understand the instructions given.
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kpinwp
1st team Player
Posts: 1,245
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Post by kpinwp on Oct 4, 2023 14:13:59 GMT
I echo Gareth's opening sentence.
One other thing that got me last night (it might as well all come out) is the fact we seemed to totally give up while only 2 down, with 20 minutes still to play, against a not too scary Salford side. Which point was loudly observed by someone behind me on la curva.
To be fair, I'd given up hope too. But I'm not getting paid for this. It is the confusion that's worrying. But it's also the loss of morale.
The only thing we have going for us is that it's still relatively early in the season. Other teams can combust too and it may take that to give us more hope. But we don't have very much time to turn things around. I sincerely hope the board are not seeing this as a possible crisis. It is one, right now.
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Post by maw on Oct 4, 2023 14:25:30 GMT
Now in our third League 2 season, we are no longer an unknown quantity.
Perhaps we have not changed much but opposition clubs have thicker files on our players and the ways our team plays.
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Post by Del on Oct 4, 2023 14:27:05 GMT
Matt has simply run out of ideas. That performance last night was dreadful. Last week i said it was too early to dispense with him but that was on the basis that i could see an improvement . Against Salford we regressed. Is our defence really that bad that we have to play 5 across the middle who simply were unable or unwilling to press. The game was not a good watch and someone said that he had reverted to the formation he used when we were struggling in the Conference. We all know he has been one of our best managers in recent times but something has very badly gone wrong either in training or in the dressing room. So far i haven't heard any Gray out shouts from the supporters but it will only be a matter of time if we continue to play this badly.
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Post by is4 on Oct 4, 2023 15:08:17 GMT
After last night's performance.And 3 days for a turn around Any predictions for Saturday?
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